At 09:09 AM 1/31/97 +0000, you wrote:
>On 31 Jan 97 at 0:59, Reed Kotler Consulting wrote:
>
>> At 09:56 PM 1/30/97 -0500, you wrote:
>> <<snip>>
>> >>
>> >>6. Analyze the patterns (or for classical guys, "motifs") in
>> >>your written transcription.
>> >>
>> >>7. Play these patterns on your instrument in all 12 keys so you
>> >>understand and can recognize the pattern in a variety of melodic
>> >>contexts.
>> >>
>> >>8. Use the patterns in a variety of solos in different keys and
>> >>analyze how to fit the patterns to the melody/harmonic progression of
>> >>whatever you're playing. To illustrate this concept Bongiorno has
>> >>you transcribe a few bars each of guitar, piano, bass and sax solos
>> >>and then synthesizes a new 16-bar solo in a new key by stringing
>> >>together four four-bar patterns each taken from a different
>> >>instrument.
>> >>
>> >>Please note that I'm not advocating any particular approach. I'm
>> >>just reporting on what I read and heard.
>> >>...
>> >
>> >This analytical approach gets you somewhere, but it can also create an
>> >analytical, not spontaneous, improvisor...
>> >
>> I analyze the solos but must admit that I'm very suspicous of
>> such methodical ways to assimilate solo material.
>>
>> I've seen them written in books and articles but I have never
>> found them of any practical use in my own playing.
>>
>> I find the approach of just transcribing the solo and then playing
>> through it, etc. much more organic.
>>
>> I would assert that for example, no top player in the history of jazz
>> has ever spend any serious time trying to do anthing even remotely
>> resembling somehing like that advocated in #7 or #8.
>
>As I've said before, I'm neutral on the value of this method.
>
>However, there have been studies done of Charlie Parker's solos
>where it seems that this is exactly what he did. References to these
>studies can be found in "Thinking in Jazz" by Paul Berliner, U of
>Chicago Press.
>
>These studies conclude that Bird didn't improvise in terms of notes,
>scales or chords but in terms of patterns and the patterns appear to
>modulated through all the keys. Bird used a bit less than 200
>patterns. Although it's possibly impossible to extrapolate methods
>from results, Parker's results may have come from this method.
>
Well the first thing is that standard reference to Bird Solos
(the one most likely used for that study) is the Omnibook.
I have trancsribed several of the same solos of that book and can
tell you that it is grossly innacurate to the point of being unusable
for any serious analysis of parkers playing.
One of the chief problems with the published transcriptions is that
the mistakes destroy the continuity of the solo and you never
can see how related everything is.
That aside....
What I see in Parkers solos is that he is playing melodies .
They seem to be very compositional.
Because all of us have a limit to how creative we can be and still
preserve quality, there is going to be repetition.
Even famous classical composers repeat themselves.
As I have stated before in the early days of the discussion list,
I believe that Parker spent alot of time writing solos.
In my opinion many of his tunes were just solos he wrote over standard
tunes of the day that held up by themselves as tunes.
If you write solos, that will happen to you.
It's happened to me on numerous occasions and I've even posted a
few of them to the website (for example my tune "I Never Knew Clifford").
I'm not saying I've written ones as good as the ones he wrote but I have on
numerous occasions set out to write a solo and it was a jazz tune by the
time I was done. It doesnt happen everytime but it happens .
To me, the way you practice will directly be refelected in the
way you play.
If you practice playing licks, patterns or scales, your playing will sound
like that. It won't sound compositional.
I know that I play certain patterns in different keys but I don't practice
that way.
I just know certain sounds and when I'm in different keys I use my ear
and find the same sounds.
Over time things I use alot become more automatic and faster but the
practicing is always in the context of making music.
To me patterns, licks, etc are a way to play lot's of notes at a time
when you shouldnt be playing so many notes.
It's best to play simply and let things develop by themselves.
I have spent some time playing things in 12 keys but it's benefit
has been more in training my mind and ear to think in different keys.
The patterns that I play quickly or that occur in my solos are not
those same patterns that I've played in 12 keys.
For me, I decided at one point that my goal was to become a top player
(something I'm working on currently).
When you make that decision, things change alot.
I've transcribed alot and I know what my heros are doing (Bill Evans,
Wes Montgomery, Clifford Brown, Charlie Parker, Jim Hall, .....)
Things get real scary then because the BS has to end if that is your
goal.
You try things like playing patterns in 12 keys and ask yourself
if that is ever going to culminate in a Bill Evans quality solo.
In the beginning I tried everything because I don't have access to
Bill Evans or Wes Montgomery to find out how they got so good and
they probably wouldnt remember all they did anyway.
Little by little I started to hear myself play things and say, yes!
that's what I'm looking for.
At first maybe it's one measure or just a few notes in a solo.
Then I started to zero in on what was working for me.
What was working for me was:
1) transcribing.
2) writing solos, tunes, etc.
3) understanding music (analysis, theory)
4) improvising simply and sincerely and letting things develop
naturally. always trying to make a melody, even if that means laying
out for several measures at times to get your bearings. This is one
of the most important elements. People, even absolute beginners, are
in way too much of a hurry to achieve the final product. As such
they just create confusion (as Bill calls it) and then continue to
build confusion on top of that hoping that things will straighten
themsleves out eventually and they never do.
5) listening to other players.
6) having contact with top players.
7) probably some other things I'm not thinking of at the moment.
reed
Reed Kotler
reed@justjazz.com
http://www.justjazz.com
Reed Kotler
reed@justjazz.com
http://www.justjazz.com